Dark Sector Refused Classification In Australia

[MUTANT SPUD]

http://au.xbox360.ign.com/articles/852/852163p1.html
I wasn't going to buy this game anyway but..here we go again! At least the censors actually sit down and play the games.To be honest from what I've seen it looks like a pretty cool game and the beastliness is meted out to our old favorites the mutant zombies.Everyone knows that you have to chop up zombies or shoot em in the head to stop them, if the protagonist was chopping up school children I'd be singing a different tune but.....they're zombies man!.....zombies!!!!:eek:

[ConstantNeophyte]

Hmm, I wonder how that will bode for us over the ditch :(

[MUTANT SPUD]

Hmm, I wonder how that will bode for us over the ditch :(
We shall see I guess..ah they'll do some half Ar$ed fix like they did with The Punisher game, grey out the gore or freeze frame the kills. I'm on record as being opposed to graphic violence anyway so I wont be too sad if I dont get to play the game..its just..Zombies, every time I say the word I get excited.:D
As long as they dont mess with GTAIV.

[ezacharyk]

It has gotten an M rating in the US. Don't know if any of you know it. I have not been following the game at all. In fact I never heard of it until the news of its banning in Australia.

[BlackIce, British Commie]

Why don't the wankers just make an 18+ rating and be done with it?

[Pominator]

because only people under 16 play videogames BlackICE! haven't you figured that out yet?

/sarcastic lack of wit

[MUTANT SPUD]

Why don't the wankers just make an 18+ rating and be done with it? The discs ship with the European 18 plus mark on them, but they print new covers with MA15+ the Australian rating, the mind boggles.

[hans moleman]

Heres a letter i sent to the PM which was passed to the Attorney General and Steven Conroy (minister for this stuff)... a few weeks ago, i think it fits in this thread. (no response yet)

To the Hon. Mr Rudd,

I have a proposition, for you, and your cabinet as a first time member of the voting public who voted you in as the Prime Minister of Australia, as a “prime minister for all Australians”. All it requires, is for you to keep following the mantra of your election, that of “new leadership”, a change in the direction of this country; something i took to heart as I placed a single number next to labor on the ballot paper using the most history defining weapon created by man, the pen.

The issue I am writing about concerns the classification of video games in our country, as it impacts on the freedom of expressing, and absorbing speech, as a gamer, and a person over 18 years of age. We currently have no R-18 classification for video games in our National Classification Code, despite films and literature having one. There are three reasons why this could be; an outdated perception that only kids play video games, thus violent games are directly targeted at and consumed by children, and must be protected from high impact violence. Theres also a number of video game critics that use crackpot theories to suggest violent games create violent people, and even to suggest the perpetrators of a number of recent schools shootings did so because of violent games. Lastly people think an R-18 rating opens the floodgates for minors to be subjected to a torrent of adult games.

These three arguments can easily be countered, the average age of gamers is actually 28 (source), so violent video games are not being targeted for consumption at kids, as they don’t need to be. Video game critics often cite evidence that video games have a causal effect on real violence, however I have been playing said games since nine, and I am no more aggressive than the average person, furthermore an Australian study showed that people predisposed to violence are the only people affected (source), and a meta-analysis by the American Sociological Association showed that most studies that proved a link between violence and behavior contradicted each other (source), lastly the Virgina tech shooting was pinned on video games, despite the fact that sonic the hedgehog was the only game the shooter played. Finally, the creation of an R-18 rating wont open the floodgates, as i could count the number of games banned with my fingers.

As you can see there is no reason to place legal restrictions on games not suitable for minors, something which is both hypocritical, and a freedom restricting cop out. Considering that movies like the saw series, and hostel can be bought by people over 15-18 years old, despite there extreme high impact violence thats more realistic than any game (and X rated material can be bought in Canberra), you can clearly see the hypocrisy of our ratings system. The simple fact that i can drink, vote, buy a handgun, or fight in a war, but cant play R rated video games as an adult is utterly ridiculous.

I ask that you review the classification legislation, that the classification board under the Attorney General’s portfolio uses and take steps to change the direction our ratings system is heading towards, as part of showing new leadership.

Sincerely,

James Gunn

[ConstantNeophyte]

Heres a letter i sent to the PM which was passed to the Attorney General and Steven Conroy (minister for this stuff)... a few weeks ago, i think it fits in this thread. (no response yet)...

Nice letter man. I was impressed :D

[hans moleman]

Thanks mate.

[MUTANT SPUD]

Yeah I've fired off letters to the AG and shadow AG, heres their postal addresses if anyone else wants to drop em a line.

Rt. Hon Robert McClelland
Attorney General for Australia
P.O Box 861
Hurstville N.S.W
2220

Senator George Brandis
Shadow Attorney General
G.P.O Box 228
Brisbane Q.L.D.
4001.

Happy lobbying:)

[hans moleman]

Agreed, lets overwhelm him with paper cuts, it might scare him into reforming the OFLC. ;)

[ZippyDSMlee]

At least Germany dose not block the sale of it in country.... sheesh ...when will these nanny states learn...

[Pominator]

They wont zippy

they will die

they will get old, no one will notice and then they will disappear

then we will be able to take over, cleverer people with a better understanding of the real world, because we, unlike them, have lived real lives, lives where we have to work for what we want and where we do our jobs to the best of our abilities.

What do they do?

Pretend like they are doing something by attacking something completely irrelevant to the real issue, making sure that people think that their government is making a difference and not just sitting in their £150,000 offices, kicking back tequilas and playing about with their female companions!

one day these people will die out, if they don't then we may just prove their point, maybe prove that videogames can make you kill people... Politicians

[MUTANT SPUD]

I got a nice letter from Senator Brandis today thanking me for my interest and basically saying that he shared my concerns and would be closely watching the upcoming meeting of state Attorneys General scheduled for later this month.
Nice of him to reply anyway.
Heres a group we may need to keep an eye on, Salt Shakers, I dont know how wide their reach is, they are connected to Summit Ministries, there's nothing on this site specifically about video games..but they seem to be putting in their two cents about everything else. http://www.saltshakers.org.au/

[MUTANT SPUD]

Today I recieved a letter from Mr Bob Debus, the minister for home affairs.
The letter, in a nutshell, stated that the federal government is aware of the issues surrounding the classification of video games and the community debate on an 18+ classification. He outlined the government's position regarding the current system citing the need to balance the right of adults to view, read and play content of their choice while protecting minors from material which may disturb or harm them. When the censorship ministers meet this month the issue of video game classification will be on their agenda and should they consider the current regime to be insufficient there will be a process of community consultation so that everyone can put their views forward.
We wait and see, one thing the Labour party is good at is consultation, however long it takes everyone gets a say so I'll keep my ear to the ground..or the internet as it were:D

[IanCharles@gmail.com]

Update on this -
http://palgn.com.au/article.php?id=10949&sid=ef648dfb664574519990c5820ea1cb0e&title=Australia+to+receive+'toned+down'+Dark+Secto r
Following up on the fan-disappointing classification refusal of February, Dark Sector's local distributor, AFA Interactive has confirmed its intentions to release a build based on the slightly sanitised Japanese version of the game down under.

Speaking with Kotaku Australia, AFA Interactive reveals it is simply waiting for publisher D3 Interactive to send out the new iteration of the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 title. With "no decapitation" and "toned down...limb severing on humans (only)", AFA hopes this build will guarantee a MA15+ reclassification under the ever hypocritical rules of the Australian Office of Film and Literature Classification (OFLC).

[MUTANT SPUD]

Update on this -
http://palgn.com.au/article.php?id=10949&sid=ef648dfb664574519990c5820ea1cb0e&title=Australia+to+receive+'toned+down'+Dark+Secto r Yeah its a shame for the designers of the game having their hard work chopped up because of Australian bureaucracy.

[MUTANT SPUD]

1. R18+ classification for computer games (Vic)
Ministers:
a) noted the research and arguments for and against the introduction of an R18+ classification for computer games in Australia, and
b) agreed in principle to undertake a process of community consultation in relation to whether an R18+ classification for computer games should be introduced into the National Classification Scheme (NCS) and
(i) Requested Officers to develop a Discussion Paper that canvasses options and seeks submissions on whether an R18+ classification for computer games should be introduced into the NCS. The Discussion Paper will include an overview of the relevant research and literature and a proposal to amend the NCS, including amendments required to the Commonwealth Classification (Films, Publications, Computer Games) Act 1995 (the Commonwealth Act), the Classification Code (the Code), the Guidelines for the Classification of Films and Computer Games 2005 (the Guidelines), State and Territory Enforcement Acts (and certain Commonwealth Instruments); and
(ii) Agreed that, in accordance with the Intergovernmental Agreement on Censorship, the Discussion Paper be the subject of public consultation including consultation with industry and interest groups, once Ministers have agreed out of session (if necessary) to release the Paper; and
(iii) Agreed to consider at a subsequent meeting, the outcome of the public consultation on this issue and to resolve whether an R18+ classification for computer games should be introduced into the NCS, and amendments to give effect thereto, should procee This is the from the report on proceedings at the recent meeting of the Standing Committee Of Australian State Attorneys General held last month. We love a discussion paper here down under, at least the ball is rolling, we now need to wait until they call for submissions and see who puts their hand up, all very interesting:) It'll be interesting also to see how sales of the edited version of GTAIV affect the debate, whether retailers will speak up and how the government will respond if significant numbers of orders are placed with overseas retailers such as those in New Zealand, where the game is not censored.

[Clever]

I posted this elsewhere but I'm thinking of editing it a bit and sending it to my politician. Not like they'll read it but I hope their minion enjoys it....

I just got back from Gametraders Robina, recently made famous by Yahtzee, and I came away completely disgusted with our government. Video games here are governed by a police state. I mean that quite literally. I'm not some kid with a bandanna around his head that screams "police brutality" when he gets asked to politely step out of the car when he's cruising down the highway with a crack pipe in his mouth. Nor am I one of those "enlightened" 15 year olds that has "totally figured out the world". In fact, I'm a Bible thumping conservative if you must know. But back to the issue at hand, I asked "Joe" (as I fear for his safety) at Gametraders what he could do about importing me a copy of GTAIV to satisfy my depraved lust for shooting virtual rapists in the groin (what other possible reason could I have other than wanting to save $50) and he told me that that wouldn't be possible. We got into a conversation with him revealing that he's lost about 400 preorders. Gametraders Robina isn't a big store. JBHiFi and EB are in the same section of the town centre and I've often felt pity for them. He's losing thousands upon thousands of dollars here. I asked him what he thought about using play-asia.com, he said, and I quote, "it probably won't get past customs, if they find it they'll destroy it and send you the bill for the destruction."

I'm 21, sure I may be living out my childhood dream of being a game developer, but on paper I'm a bloody adult. I pay taxes, I vote, and I choose what I want to watch. If I drive down the Gold Coast highway I see massive adverts and stores for every sort of "sextainment" you can think of. And before you ask, yes, they have that too. If I leave the television on I'll be able to see Hollywood movies completely uncut, nipples, clits, tits, explosions, guts, gore, good ol' fashioned cussing, and general violent tomfoolery fully intact. But God forbid I watch a cutscene where somebody gets shot in their huevoes... destroying the media an adult wishes to import is no different than burning books. If this was the mid-90's I would say "I am not down" with this. I'm hearing talk now that the R18+ rating will get shot down and is at least another 2 years away from consideration. Meanwhile the economy just missed out on a few million dollars in order to save the children of lazy, shiftless, no good, should have worn a rubber, completely unfit, and useless parents from something that wouldn't, as all evidence (a foreign term to so many dissenters) points, harm them in the first place. Now if you'll excuse me, the sex shop across from the public beach is about to close and I'm in the mood for something moist. Cio`

[ZippyDSMlee]

I posted this elsewhere but I'm thinking of editing it a bit and sending it to my politician. Not like they'll read it but I hope their minion enjoys it....

I just got back from Gametraders Robina, recently made famous by Yahtzee, and I came away completely disgusted with our government. Video games here are governed by a police state. I mean that quite literally. I'm not some kid with a bandanna around his head that screams "police brutality" when he gets asked to politely step out of the car when he's cruising down the highway with a crack pipe in his mouth. Nor am I one of those "enlightened" 15 year olds that has "totally figured out the world". In fact, I'm a Bible thumping conservative if you must know. But back to the issue at hand, I asked "Joe" (as I fear for his safety) at Gametraders what he could do about importing me a copy of GTAIV to satisfy my depraved lust for shooting virtual rapists in the groin (what other possible reason could I have other than wanting to save $50) and he told me that that wouldn't be possible. We got into a conversation with him revealing that he's lost about 400 preorders. Gametraders Robina isn't a big store. JBHiFi and EB are in the same section of the town centre and I've often felt pity for them. He's losing thousands upon thousands of dollars here. I asked him what he thought about using play-asia.com, he said, and I quote, "it probably won't get past customs, if they find it they'll destroy it and send you the bill for the destruction."

I'm 21, sure I may be living out my childhood dream of being a game developer, but on paper I'm a bloody adult. I pay taxes, I vote, and I choose what I want to watch. If I drive down the Gold Coast highway I see massive adverts and stores for every sort of "sextainment" you can think of. And before you ask, yes, they have that too. If I leave the television on I'll be able to see Hollywood movies completely uncut, nipples, clits, tits, explosions, guts, gore, good ol' fashioned cussing, and general violent tomfoolery fully intact. But God forbid I watch a cutscene where somebody gets shot in their huevoes... destroying the media an adult wishes to import is no different than burning books. If this was the mid-90's I would say "I am not down" with this. I'm hearing talk now that the R18+ rating will get shot down and is at least another 2 years away from consideration. Meanwhile the economy just missed out on a few million dollars in order to save the children of lazy, shiftless, no good, should have worn a rubber, completely unfit, and useless parents from something that wouldn't, as all evidence (a foreign term to so many dissenters) points, harm them in the first place. Now if you'll excuse me, the sex shop across from the public beach is about to close and I'm in the mood for something moist. Cio`


contrast and contradiction makes society.
lest your not in the US where you can buy unrated DVDs but sex shops are heavily regulated....

[beemoh]

I asked him what he thought about using play-asia.com, he said, and I quote, "it probably won't get past customs, if they find it they'll destroy it and send you the bill for the destruction."

Oh which note, if anyone in AU wants a copy sent over in a plain brown envolope that doesn't have some online store plastered all over it, PM me and I'll put you in touch with someone who can sort that out.

[ZippyDSMlee]

Oh which note, if anyone in AU wants a copy sent over in a plain brown envolope that doesn't have some online store plastered all over it, PM me and I'll put you in touch with someone who can sort that out.

to this I shall 2nd this...but it will have naw and drool marks :X (as in I will be happy to ship world wide at cost)

[KN]

I posted this elsewhere but I'm thinking of editing it a bit and sending it to my politician. Not like they'll read it but I hope their minion enjoys it....

I just got back from Gametraders Robina, recently made famous by Yahtzee, and I came away completely disgusted with our government. Video games here are governed by a police state. I mean that quite literally. I'm not some kid with a bandanna around his head that screams "police brutality" when he gets asked to politely step out of the car when he's cruising down the highway with a crack pipe in his mouth. Nor am I one of those "enlightened" 15 year olds that has "totally figured out the world". In fact, I'm a Bible thumping conservative if you must know. But back to the issue at hand, I asked "Joe" (as I fear for his safety) at Gametraders what he could do about importing me a copy of GTAIV to satisfy my depraved lust for shooting virtual rapists in the groin (what other possible reason could I have other than wanting to save $50) and he told me that that wouldn't be possible. We got into a conversation with him revealing that he's lost about 400 preorders. Gametraders Robina isn't a big store. JBHiFi and EB are in the same section of the town centre and I've often felt pity for them. He's losing thousands upon thousands of dollars here. I asked him what he thought about using play-asia.com, he said, and I quote, "it probably won't get past customs, if they find it they'll destroy it and send you the bill for the destruction."

I'm 21, sure I may be living out my childhood dream of being a game developer, but on paper I'm a bloody adult. I pay taxes, I vote, and I choose what I want to watch. If I drive down the Gold Coast highway I see massive adverts and stores for every sort of "sextainment" you can think of. And before you ask, yes, they have that too. If I leave the television on I'll be able to see Hollywood movies completely uncut, nipples, clits, tits, explosions, guts, gore, good ol' fashioned cussing, and general violent tomfoolery fully intact. But God forbid I watch a cutscene where somebody gets shot in their huevoes... destroying the media an adult wishes to import is no different than burning books. If this was the mid-90's I would say "I am not down" with this. I'm hearing talk now that the R18+ rating will get shot down and is at least another 2 years away from consideration. Meanwhile the economy just missed out on a few million dollars in order to save the children of lazy, shiftless, no good, should have worn a rubber, completely unfit, and useless parents from something that wouldn't, as all evidence (a foreign term to so many dissenters) points, harm them in the first place. Now if you'll excuse me, the sex shop across from the public beach is about to close and I'm in the mood for something moist. Cio`

Holy **** you've been to GAMETRADERS ROBINA. I envy you.

[MUTANT SPUD]

I'm not buying GTAIV because its too expensive in Australia $120..approx $112 U.S money, R* can go screw themselves if they're going to be like that, they'll sell millions of copies anyway so why not make it $80..I got Lost Odyssey, which is 4 discs brand new for $79 from EB, and it wasn't on special.. I've gone off GTA altogether, I'll get it in 12 months from Cash Converters or E- Bay for $30.. in the meantime I've got other games to spend my money and time on. I'd actually rather they had banned GTAIV rather than give it a 15+ rating, now every 12 year old in the country will be online with it acting like a tw@t ..no thanks.:mad: Gametraders are too expensive, on the other hand their rentals are reasonable and their sales people or franchisees or whatever are usually pretty cool, I go to the one in Moonee Ponds a bit, they also have a good selection of retro stuff too.

[ZippyDSMlee]

I'm not buying GTAIV because its too expensive in Australia $120..approx $112 U.S money, R* can go screw themselves if they're going to be like that, they'll sell millions of copies anyway so why not make it $80..I got Lost Odyssey, which is 4 discs brand new for $79 from EB, and it wasn't on special.. I've gone off GTA altogether, I'll get it in 12 months from Cash Converters or E- Bay for $30.. in the meantime I've got other games to spend my money and time on. I'd actually rather they had banned GTAIV rather than give it a 15+ rating, now every 12 year old in the country will be online with it acting like a tw@t ..no thanks.:mad: Gametraders are too expensive, on the other hand their rentals are reasonable and their sales people or franchisees or whatever are usually pretty cool, I go to the one in Moonee Ponds a bit, they also have a good selection of retro stuff too.

its the rice industry has setup for your region, but if I got it and sent it to you it would come up 80$ or 90$ 60+ 5-10 shipping for me to get it and another 15-20$ to ship it to you with shipping.

[Clever]

Gametraders are too expensive

That's strange. I've always found them to be cheaper - GTA was $94 which was like $30 cheaper than what EB or JB had... but I have noticed for some PC games they're a bit more expensive... it has something to do with economics I think... :rolleyes:

[MUTANT SPUD]

That's strange. I've always found them to be cheaper - GTA was $94 which was like $30 cheaper than what EB or JB had... but I have noticed for some PC games they're a bit more expensive... it has something to do with economics I think... :rolleyes:Oh right..I'll go and have a look, last time I was in there was about 3 months ago and they were still selling a lot of older 360 games for top dollar. JB also had a deal where you could trade 3 360 games and get GTAIV free, not that I have 3 games I want to get rid of , nevertheless I can wait a while I'm poor at the moment anyway, all my money is going to pay my tax bill.

[MUTANT SPUD]

Th OFLC is at it again:
http://www.gameplayer.com.au/gp_documents/080927OFLCShushSH.aspx
I'm seeing a pattern here, interactivity seems to bother them more than content. We can watch, for example the leg breaking scene in Assassin's Creed or the golf club scene in Bioshock but we're not allowed to play similar scenarios. Look at GTAIV and Fallout 3, you can show Jacob walking around with a blunt in his hand for 90% of his scenes but you can't use morphine syrettes in FO3. It'll be interesting to see how this pans out, I don't know if the howls of protest will be as loud for Silent Hill as they were for FO3 but the changes made to that game set a precedent. So we'll see how important a tiny market like Australia is to the game makers, whether a minority view is imposed on the majority again ( Mods: no I'm not going down that road again, this is in context).

[ZippyDSMlee]

Th OFLC is at it again:
http://www.gameplayer.com.au/gp_documents/080927OFLCShushSH.aspx
I'm seeing a pattern here, interactivity seems to bother them more than content. We can watch, for example the leg breaking scene in Assassin's Creed or the golf club scene in Bioshock but we're not allowed to play similar scenarios. Look at GTAIV and Fallout 3, you can show Jacob walking around with a blunt in his hand for 90% of his scenes but you can't use morphine syrettes in FO3. It'll be interesting to see how this pans out, I don't know if the howls of protest will be as loud for Silent Hill as they were for FO3 but the changes made to that game set a precedent. So we'll see how important a tiny market like Australia is to the game makers, whether a minority view is imposed on the majority again ( Mods: no I'm not going down that road again, this is in context).

How permanent is the OFLC committee/board?
Germany's SKU has a regularly changing panel thus why you get some games passed and some not passed.

[MUTANT SPUD]

How permanent is the OFLC committee/board?
Germany's SKU has a regularly changing panel thus why you get some games passed and some not passed.

http://www.classification.gov.au/special.html?n=261&p=67
The Convenor and her deputy have been there a while, which to me seems sensible, what with the way technology advances continuity must be a factor. I must say that the qualifications of the board members are outstanding, we can't complain about the competency of the personnel, its the classification act that's the problem.