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ZippyDSMlee
03-08-2007, 08:57 AM
At the recent Game Developers Conference, Chris Hecker, the founder of "Defintion 6", unleashed an attack on the Wii and Nintendo claiming they fail to recognize games as an "art form".

His attack came during the "Burning Mad: Game Publishers Rant session". Last year at the same rant session, he attacked the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 for focusing on graphics instead of gameplay. He finished off his 2006 rant by asking "Will Nintendo save us?". Judging by his 2007 rant, the answer to that is "No".

Included in his rant were the following comments: "I have uncovered the secret to Wii manufacturing. The way you manufacture a Wii is you take two GameCubes and some duct tape".

He continues with: "This thing is totally underpowered... This is not about graphics, more polygons, all that kind of crap. What I want to be able to do is spend CPU to make the machine smarter, more interesting and more automatically intelligent.

"It's about interactivity - that is the key differentiator of our art form, and interactivity is about doing something interesting with that input and threading it back to the user. You can't do that with a POS underpowered computer."

Hecker then questioned whether Nintendo cared about games as an "art form".He observed that a simple Google search revealed that the phrase "art form" was found on PlayStation.com 30 times, on Xbox.com 13 times, and a combined 7 times on Wii.com and nintendo.com.

Hecker then took a quote from Zelda creator Eiji Aonuma, "I don't feel that games can necessarily be considered art. There's nothing wrong with that; our goal is just to make games that are fun." His response was: "This is not good enough for people who are leading our industry... If we're going to make games the art from of the 21st century, we need people who care more than just, 'I'm going to make some fun toys."

Hecker concluded his speech by outlining his demands for Nintendo: "Number one: recognise and push games as a serious art form. Number two: make a console that doesn't suck ass."

http://www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/8897.cfm

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His attack came during the "Burning Mad: Game Publishers Rant session". Last year at the same rant session, he attacked the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 for focusing on graphics instead of gameplay. He finished off his 2006 rant by asking "Will Nintendo save us?". Judging by his 2007 rant, the answer to that is "No".

I'll give you some rope for this one,Nintendo is not putting the extra bit of needed polish in controls,Sony and MS are still as lost as ever.

"
Included in his rant were the following comments: "I have uncovered the secret to Wii manufacturing. The way you manufacture a Wii is you take two GameCubes and some duct tape".

He continues with: "This thing is totally underpowered... This is not about graphics, more polygons, all that kind of crap. What I want to be able to do is spend CPU to make the machine smarter, more interesting and more automatically intelligent.

"It's about interactivity - that is the key differentiator of our art form, and interactivity is about doing something interesting with that input and threading it back to the user. You can't do that with a POS underpowered computer."

Ok the WII is a bit underpowered but to rape it verbally is a bit much....

Hecker then took a quote from Zelda creator Eiji Aonuma, "I don't feel that games can necessarily be considered art. There's nothing wrong with that; our goal is just to make games that are fun." His response was: "This is not good enough for people who are leading our industry... If we're going to make games the art from of the 21st century, we need people who care more than just, 'I'm going to make some fun toys."
ya ya ya ya you fail to see the art within because you have your elitist glasses on I am sorry but I would rather have a fun game/movie over a POS posh artistry pointless game or movie...much like good writing in Hollywood good gameplay/fun is rarity in gaming.

In final its not Nintendo's fault games are not a art form look at all the other publishers what do you think they do when they have a choice between a Quick cash title a "art" game or one of thos games that breaks the mold thats great in story/art and fun? they pick the whatever will get them cash as soon as possible....

kurisu7885
03-08-2007, 10:04 AM
The Wii is "underpowered" because Nintendo is focusing on fun, interesting game,s not weather or not a basketball player can sweat realistically.

ZippyDSMlee
03-08-2007, 02:18 PM
The Wii is "underpowered" because Nintendo is focusing on fun, interesting game,s not weather or not a basketball player can sweat realistically.

or seeing the jigglyness in breasts or the detail of a thong on a female model is somehow art :3

Xlorep DarkHelm
03-08-2007, 04:54 PM
In an IM conversation between me and my roommate on this, we concluded the following:

(12:08:58 PM) Boffo: yep... so which would you rather play? Super Mario Bros., or The Bouncer for PS2?
(12:09:11 PM) Xlorep DarkHelm: SMB, hands down :P

Graphics without gameplay is a movie. Gameplay without graphics is ZORK. ZORK is a classic, and the foundation from which many of the modern online games are derived. Therefore, gameplay without graphics is still a game.

I think Mr. Maxis Guy really needs to cut back on whatever he's been smoking.

ZippyDSMlee
03-08-2007, 05:04 PM
In an IM conversation between me and my roommate on this, we concluded the following:



Graphics without gameplay is a movie. Gameplay without graphics is ZORK. ZORK is a classic, and the foundation from which many of the modern online games are derived. Therefore, gameplay without graphics is still a game.

I think Mr. Maxis Guy really needs to cut back on whatever he's been smoking.

ZORK was in the era of text based adventures and basic graphic based still image adventures so theres a difference,the difference as follows

Graphics without gameplay=Silent film for Games.
Gameplay without graphics=Radio theater of the mind.
Gameplay WITH Graphics=A Great Modern Movie.


difference's matter...mew =0_o=

steelcobra
03-08-2007, 05:29 PM
In an IM conversation between me and my roommate on this, we concluded the following:



Graphics without gameplay is a movie. Gameplay without graphics is ZORK. ZORK is a classic, and the foundation from which many of the modern online games are derived. Therefore, gameplay without graphics is still a game.

I think Mr. Maxis Guy really needs to cut back on whatever he's been smoking.

You can't really use those two as an example though. I'd rather play Kiwi Kraze (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiwi_Kraze) than The Bouncer.

ZippyDSMlee
03-08-2007, 05:36 PM
You can't really use those two as an example though. I'd rather play Kiwi Kraze (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kiwi_Kraze) than The Bouncer.

I think his point is a game is a game regardless of how "bad" it is.

My point being theres levels of "bad"....

John
03-08-2007, 05:48 PM
I wonder what he's going to get bashed for more. The fact that he bashed the Wii or the fact that he didn't bash the PS3...again?

Still, show me a definition of art. Everyone has a different definition of what is art. Some people find cars to be art. Me? Not so much.

ZippyDSMlee
03-08-2007, 05:57 PM
I wonder what he's going to get bashed for more. The fact that he bashed the Wii or the fact that he didn't bash the PS3...again?

Still, show me a definition of art. Everyone has a different definition of what is art. Some people find cars to be art. Me? Not so much.

Art is where you find it,I love transformers and think they are a form of art,the art world would piss in its pants if it heard that,piss in its pants then display it with the cross in pee,point is a great game that can tell a great story and not lose allot of the basics of being a game is "art" at tis best a dim lil 2d blob fighter is "art" at its worst...


Now what I think he is getting at is for gaming to be less shallow and a great medium for telling a story akin to better movies/media with that said game play is to games as screen writing is to movies witch is itself a art,the art world of course only likes their small definition of "art" plus he likes to rant so meh.

Xlorep DarkHelm
03-08-2007, 07:53 PM
ZORK was in the era of text based adventures and basic graphic based still image adventures so theres a difference,the difference as follows

Graphics without gameplay=Silent film for Games.
Gameplay without graphics=Radio theater of the mind.
Gameplay WITH Graphics=A Great Modern Movie.


difference's matter...mew =0_o=

Of course, if you have a good mix of both, then it can be incredible. My problem is that most games are good at one or the other, but not both. In those cases, I'd rather they be good with gameplay, than good with graphics. Personally, I'd love to see games that achieve both (God of War jumps to mind), but in the end, I definitely weigh gameplay over graphics.

Thefremen
03-09-2007, 12:05 AM
To Quote Mr. Burns: "I don't know art, but I know what I hate. I don't hate this."

What we need is more games that represent the creators feelings about the spanish civil war, or about flowers that look suspiciously like vaginas.

ZippyDSMlee
03-09-2007, 12:09 AM
To Quote Mr. Burns: "I don't know art, but I know what I hate. I don't hate this."

What we need is more games that represent the creators feelings about the spanish civil war, or about flowers that look suspiciously like vaginas.

But flowers are what vegans become when they die...oh...wait...never mind :P

Thefremen
03-09-2007, 01:19 AM
But flowers are what vegans become when they die...oh...wait...never mind :P

I was reffering to Pablo Picasso and Georgia O'Keefe respectively...

Picho
03-09-2007, 01:23 AM
Castle of the winds is a game with low graphics (everything is built out of icons) I still play the game.